Sunday, 15 April 2012

Catholic Chutzpah: It Pells for thee, cardinal Pell

 prepared 10 18 am  Sunday April 15, 2012

----- Original Message -----
From: g87
Sent: Sunday, April 15, 2012 10:18 AM
Subject: Catholic Chutzpah: It Pells for thee, cardinal Pell

Editor Jewish News
Dear Sir
You are invited to edit the below judiciously: I do not seriouly 'expect' publication in full.
The items well - below are for your interest.
Further information is available on my website: I send you merely one link herein.

Geoff Seidner
13 Alston Grove
East St Kilda 3183
03 9525 9299
Catholic Chutzpah: It Pells for thee, cardinal Pell

''Poor little Jewish people, they were originally shepherds..'' 

He should not have inadvertently quoted the Hebrew Psalm #23: which the Church has plundered / plagiarised /  re - used/ from classical Jewish sources [take your choice, editor!]

The Lord is my shepherd ....

I ask the Cardinal: given how Jews have been  tormented and murdered  by scores of yours and other civilized peoples over the millenia - why have all of them essentially disappeared?

Even the Romans have been reduced to a tiny plot in the vainglorious Vatican.
OK editor - delete 'vainglorious' - it is nice alliteration though!

The Jews survived - and plainly dominated any list of Nobel prize winners? And more - much more. And you know it.

Pell - you are in denial. 

How did you expect that the only one of the three major religions [the Jews] to not so behave to the other two - to be other than shepherds?
When the rest of the so - called 'civilized' world came to be closer to being so - the Jews became / were allowed to excel - and they became other than shepherds, money lenders. [don't get me started!]

The founder of your religion was a shepherd, Cardinal.
But I plaintively ask: why doth ye motivate yourself to mention this big - time looser comment? How could you be so lacking in guile?

All I see is some obscene comparison between the suffering of Nazi
Germany and the victims as I look in vain for solace, excuse in the original text of the Q & A programme - and the justification the Cardinal promulgated in last week's Jewish News

In the name of the 6 million murdered by the Nazis - I  impeach, condemn and denounce you.

Your comments were too deliberative and your apologies mealy - mouthed, self serving clap trap!

Thank goodness we live in a society that forces you to apologize for behaviour untenable.

Geoff Seidner


The below was emailed to Cardinal Pell on Wednesday 11/4/12
approx 12.45 pm


You have had well over 24 hours to respond: you are not going to, are you? You are too busy opening some art gallery or whatever ....I barely hear on the news.

Plainly you do not have a visage of my gorgeous 4 year old aunty Veronka Scheffer to disturb you.

I never knew this lovely, adorable little girl; she was murdered by the German Nazis 2 years before I was born.

As I wrote earlier - I impeach the horrible visage your public utterance gave me - how ''No people have suffered in history as much as the German people.''

I condemn the utter ahistorical asinine absurd study in comparative obscenity that you so glibly, deliberately conjured.

denounce you as being contemptuous of basic humanity - in daring to make such a comparison  - then to make sure no one misunderstood - essentialy refuseing to withdraw it via:

''Yes - the Jews too''
 Mind you - this pathetic non - vitiation came about only because you were confronted with a very basic synopsis of the Jews and the ultimate horror of the holocaust by comperer Tony Jones!
Oh yes - I think I am beginning you understand you now Cardinal your eminence!

The German Nazis just had enough time to kill her before the German Nazis were routed. my mother used to tell me how this child - whose life was snuffed out in those German gas chambers and incineration machinery of Auschwitz, looked to her as a mother figure.
They adored each other,  Cardinal Pell.
  1. I guess you can see the 50 million dead the German Nazis [quote you on Q and A] caused. But not Veronka or the six million.
  2. No - you can see only how terrible it must have been for the German Nazis to drag  her innocent tiny body ready for Jewish workers to throw her into the incinerator!!
  3. No - you can see how terrible it must have been to perchance  make soap of her!!
  4. No - you can see how terrible it must have been to perchance  make lampshades of her beautiful skin!!
  5. No - you can see how terrible it must have been for Germans to perchance  use her hair as a wig!!
  6. No - I guess you can vitiate all traces of her and the Six Million by contemplating how the German Nazis suffered post traumatic stress disorder because too many Jews survived!
  7. No - I guess you contemplated how terrible it must have been for the German Nazi to come home after a hard day at the death factory!
  8. How difficult to describe how maybe they 'did their backs in' as they watched  Jews throw her body into the incinerator!
  9. 'Poor' Germans - pathetic you!
  10. At least the modern - day Germans would have possibly had you arrested for essentially denying the holocaust! You deserve it Cardinal: you are more influential than the sick, unsubtle David Irving.

x. That is - the tenth of the pius ones methinks?

To the shame of your church they have chosen to refuse all  entreaties to admit what Pius and others  did_ it resides in your archives, Cardinal!
While you are about it - why don't you read the article in The Australian//////////////see link below!
And my unanswerable email re your archives--- wherein you have stored Jewish religious items you have plundered!!
See my email on the very bottom of these files!
Answer me, Cardinal!

The Australian - Shroud of secrecy lifts from Vatican archives
2 Mar 2012 – ROME: The Vatican is giving the public a rare, if temporary, peek inside its secret archive. The Vatican kicked off a sixmonth exhibit at Rome's ...
You've visited this page 4 times. Last visit: 11/04/12

To the shame of - you claim him sinless - like all other popes - even those who murdered Jews as they plaintively refused to be converted under the so - called Crusades!
And there are hundreds more acts of murder and mayhem they were responsible for. Sinless  - huh?

Tell me Cardinal - which of the major religions have ever done anything to the other two?
My people have suffered from being OFFICIALLY demonized by your Church: thus the denoument on this via an earlier papal encyclical.
To his credit - it was Pope Paul xxiii?

But you come along - and further besmirch your Church's  reputation!
You have a lot to answer for - I hold in Limbo why I think you did this!

I send you  the Prime Minister of Israel's speech recently: NEVER AGAIN CARDINAL!!

Read the speech Cardinal - it has salience for you!


For whom the bell tolls

For whom the bell tolls - the meaning and origin of this saying. ... involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bells tolls; it tolls for thee." ..

For whom the bell tolls


A quotation from a work by John Donne, in which he explores the interconnectedness of humanity - see below.


John Donne (1572-1631), Devotions Upon Emergent Occasions, Meditation XVII: Nunc Lento Sonitu Dicunt, Morieris:
"Perchance he for whom this bell tolls may be so ill, as that he knows not it tolls for him; and perchance I may think myself so much better than I am, as that they who are about me, and see my state, may have caused it to toll for me, and I know not that.
No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. If a clod be washed away by the sea, Europe is the less, as well as if a promontory were, as well as if a manor of thy friend's or of thine own were: any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bells tolls; it tolls for thee."
Donne lived in Tudor and Stewart England, and at that time the tolling of church bells, to mark various events, was an important feature of daily life. The tolling referred to in the quotation is, of course, that of funeral bells. Donne's view, which has, oddly for a 17th century Christian, much in common with 21st century eastern religions, was that all people are socially and religiously interconnected; for example, the contemporary Buddhist view is demonstrated by the reply given by the Dalai Lama, when asked during a visit to Northern Ireland how the warring Protestants and Catholics could co-exist: "Remember we are all one - all the same". Donne seems to be saying, whatever affects one affects us all. This is highlighted by the famous 'no man is an island' line at the beginning of the 'for whom the bells tolls' paragraph.
Donne's Meditations concern man's spiritual and social functioning, especially with regard to illness and death. They are somewhat mystical and difficult to interpret, especially without the benefit of an experience of the nuances of the social and religious sensibilities of a 17th century Englishman. It is a testament to his insight that the work contains much that strikes deep chords with people living and dying today.
There's some debate about what precisely was meant; some view it simply that Donne was pointing out people's mortality and that when a funeral bell was heard it was a reminder that we are nearer death each day, i.e. the bell is tolling for us. Others view it more mystically and argue that Donne is saying we are all one and that, when one dies, we all die a little. This isn't as bleak as it might sound, as the counterpoint would be that there is some part of the living in the dead and that we continue a form of life after death.
Ernest Hemingway helped to make the phrase commonplace in the language when he chose to use the quotation for the title of his 1940-published book about the Spanish Civil War. Hemingway refers back to 'for whom the bells tolls' and to 'no man is an island' to demonstrate and to examine his feelings of solidarity with the allied groups fighting the fascists. There was a strong feeling amongst many intellectuals around the world at the time that it was a moral duty to fight fascism, which they feared may take root world-wide if not checked. This was given voice later in the well-known poem, First They Came for the Jews, attributed to Pastor Martin Niemöller:
First they came for the Jews
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for the Communists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a Communist.

Then they came for the trade unionists
and I did not speak out
because I was not a trade unionist.

Then they came for me
and there was no one left to speak out for me.
Hemingway adapted the novel as the screenplay to a successful 1943 film of the same title, starring Gary Cooper and Ingrid Bergman.

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